远东国际军事法庭庭审记录翻译案例）
Wednesday, 16 April 1947
1947年4月16日，星期三
Site:Court House of the Tribunal War Ministry Building Tokyo, Japan
日本东京都旧陆军省大厦内远东国际军事法庭
The Tribunal met, pursuant to adjournment, at 09:30.
休庭后，于上午9:30重新开庭。
Appearances:
出庭情况：
For the Tribunal, same as before.
庭方人员，同前。
For the Prosecution Section, same as before.
检方人员，同前。
For the Defense Section, same as before.
辩方人员，同前。
(English to Japanese and Japanese to English interpretation was made by the Language Section, IMTFE)
（英日、日英口译，由远东国际军事法庭语言部负责）
MARSHAL OF THE COURT: The International Military Tribunal for the Far East is now in session.
法庭执行官：远东国际军事法庭现在开庭。
THE PRESIDENT: All the accused are present except TOGO, who the Sugamo prison surgeon says is unable to attend the trial today through illness. The certificate will be recorded and filed. The accused TOGO is represented by counsel.
庭长：除东乡茂德外，所有被告都已到庭。经巢鸭监狱医务官证实东乡茂德病重，无法参加今天的审判，由其律师代理出庭。医生证明将被记录并存档。
Mr Cunningham.
柯明斯-卡尔先生。
JIRO MINAMI, one of the accused, resumed the stand and testified through Japanese interpreters as follows:
南次郎作为被告之一再次出庭，通过日籍口译作证如下：
CROSS-EXAMINATION
交叉询问
BY MR. COMYNS CARR (Continued):
由柯明斯-卡尔先生进行（继续）：
Q(Mr COMYNS CARR): General MINAMI, it has been suggested to me that you didn't hear the last document, which I put to you, being read over the IBM. Is that so?
A(JIRO MINAMI): I could not hear very well.
问：南大将，有报告向我反映说，上次审理时我向你宣读的文件并通过耳机给你播放时，你没有听见。是这样吗？
A (JIRO MINAMI): I could not hear very well.
答：我当时听得不是很清楚。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Well, perhaps you would like to look at it then; would you?
问：那么可能你还要看看文件是吧。
MR. COMYNS CARR: May he have the original of 195, please.
柯明斯-卡尔先生：请向证人递交法庭证据第195号原文。
(Whereupon, the document above referred to was handed to the witness.)
（向证人递交证据）
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): (Continuing) Just look at it for yourself and tell us whether there is anything you want to say about it.
问：（继续）请你自己读下这份书证。如果有什么想说的话，请说出来。
A (JIRO MINAMI): I have glanced through the document. I think this is a document in which an outline of publicity policy has been laid out in case of an emergency or some eventuality and it appears to me that this was an internal arrangement between the Chief of Staff and the Vice-Minister; and for that reason, I do not recall this matter very well.
答：我看了一下，我想这份文件写的是紧急情况下的宣传纲要。这是参谋长和陆军次官之间内部的商议，所以我对于这件事不记得了。
THE PRESIDENT: He recalls it, but not very well, I take it.
庭长：你记得，但是不清楚。我知道了。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): But you told me yesterday that the Chief of Staff sent it with your approval.
问：但是昨天证人你和我说参谋长是得到了你的许可之后才寄送给陆军次官的。
A (JIRO MINAMI): If so, I was mistaken.
答：如果我是那样说的话，那就是我说错了。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Do you mean that your Chief of Staff would send a document of this kind to the Vice-War Minister contrary to your instructions?
问：你的意思是参谋长违背了你的命令，私自给陆军次官寄送了这份文件，是吗？
A (JIRO MINAMI): That is so. The sending or exchanging of such plans or ideas between the Chief of Staff and the Vice-Minister is carried on internally between themselves for the purpose of trying to seek a meeting of minds on certain subjects. Thus, if any document is sent in the name of the Commander-in-Chief, then such document goes only to the Minister and not to the Vice-Minister.
答：就是那样。我想这是参谋长和陆军次官之间为了相互意思疏通、了解对方想法的往来。通常，如果这是以军司令官名义发出的话，那么一定是寄给陆军大臣而不是陆军次官。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Do you suggest that General NISHIO would have put forward a document like this without consulting it, without obtaining your approval of the substance of it?
问：你是指西尾大将写的该文件的内容在没有得到你的批准的情况下，将其寄送至了陆军次官处。是这样吗？
A (JIRO MINAMI): The practice of such documents being sent without the knowledge or approval of the Commanding General frequently happens.
答：这种类型的文件经常是陆军大臣不知晓或未批准的情况下寄送出去的。
THE PRESIDENT: But he recalled it.
庭长：但是他刚才说了他还有些记忆。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): How do you recall it if it was sent without your knowledge or approval?
问：如果这份文件是在未得到你许可或知晓的情况下寄送的，你怎么记得有这份文件？
A (JIRO MINAMI): I do not understand the question.
答：我不明白这个问题是什么意思。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): You said a little while ago that you recalled the document although not very well; that is, remember it although not very well.
问：你刚才说你对于这份文件有印象，虽然不是很清楚了。
THE INTERPRETER: This is the Language Section. Apparently, there is confusion resulting from a misinterpretation or misunderstanding of the word "recall." That is, one has been taken from the standpoint of recollection, the other from the standpoint of calling the document back. We should like of the prosecutor to put a new question so that this confusion might be cleared up.
口译员：这里是语言部。很明显“recall”一词的误解或误译导致了现在的混乱。该词可以理解为“回忆”，也可以理解为“将文件再次召回”。我们恳请检察官换个方式提问，这样误解便可以消除。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Did you not say a little while ago that you remember this document although not very well?
问：证人你刚才说你记得这份文件，但不是记得很清楚。对吗？
A (JIRO MINAMI): In as much as I was unable to understand what the document was about yesterday, I asked that I be shown this document.
答：昨天宣读时我并没有很好地理解这份文件，所以我就要求如果有原文的话请给我看一下。
THE PRESIDENT: The word "recall" was first used by the interpreter this morning as something said by MINAMI.
庭长：“recall”一词，今天早上南证人提到一些事情时由译员首次使用。
MR. COMYNS CARR: Would the interpreter kindly tell us whether when that word was used in the first place by MINAMI the Japanese word meant remember or something different?
柯明斯-卡尔先生：口译员是否可以告诉我们当这个词首次出现时，南证人所说的日语是否表示他记得或其他的意思？
THE INTERPRETER: It meant in connection with recollection.
口译员：它表示与回忆相关联。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): How do you recollect the document if it was issued without your authority or knowledge?
问：如果你并没有批准这份文件且并不知道其存在时，你又是如何记得这份文件的？
A (JIRO MINAMI): When the document was read yesterday, I remembered a part of it, but not being quite familiar with it, I asked that I be shown this document. Having seen the document I said, as I have said before, that such documents as these were frequently exchanged between the Chief of Staff and the Vice-Minister in connection with matters which should be taken--action which should be taken in case of emergencies or eventualities.
答：因为昨天文件宣读时，我听了之后就想起了其中一部分内容，但是并不是非常熟悉，所以想请求给我看一下原文件。看了之后便知道，这是刚才我说的参谋长和陆军次官之间关于紧急情况下应采取的措施的研究事项，经常会发生这种事情，我想说的就是这些。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): That doesn't answer the question. How do you remember it if it wasn't shown to you at the time when it was issued?
问：你并没有回答我的问题。如果那份文件寄送时你并没有看到过，那么你今天是如何想起这份文件的呢？
A (JIRO MINAMI): I felt that such things really happened without having been told about the document yesterday. Well, I felt that such a thing may have happened without having been told of the document yesterday.
答：我昨天才感觉原来有这样的事情，之前都没人告诉过我。我昨天才感觉原来有发生过这样的事情，之前都没人告诉过我。
THE PRESIDENT: That answer cannot be accepted. It is a direct contradiction of what he said according to the interpreter this morning.
庭长：这个答案无法接受。这与今天早上口译员翻译的内容完全不一致。
THE WITNESS: In short, I saw this document with my own eyes for the first time this morning and felt that this was a matter that was considered in case of eventualities. At least it isn't a document that I signed myself.
证人：总之，我是今天才第一次看到这份文件，才知道它是讨论突发情况时的事项。至少我没有在这上面签字。
THE PRESIDENT: I think you ought to leave it at that, MR. Carr. We can form our own conclusions.
庭长：我认为你可以结束这个话题了，卡尔先生。法庭会得出自己的结论。
MR. COMYNS CARR: If your Honor pleases.
柯明斯-卡尔先生：好的，庭长先生。
BY MR. COMYNS CARR (Continued):
由柯明斯-卡尔先生进行（继续）：
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Now, General MINAMI, on page 16 of your affidavit, paragraph 10, the last sentence, you are speaking of what you did after you went to Korea, and you say, "As Governor General, I have nothing to say except that I devoted myself entirely to the elevation of the status and conditions of the Korean people." Do you mean that you took no part in any matters that were going on outside Korea?
问：南大将，在你宣誓证词第16页第10段的最后一句中，你提到你去朝鲜之后所做的事情，“我作为朝鲜总督除了致力于提高朝鲜居民的地位之外，没有特别值得记述的事情。”你的意思是朝鲜以外地方发生的一切事件与你都没有关系，是吗？
A (JIRO MINAMI): Exactly.
答：正是如此。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): In your interrogation you said this: "Q What members of the cabinet other than the War Minister did you deal with?" That is when you were in Korea. Was that correct?
问：在你的询问记录中，你是这样说的：“问：你有没有和陆军大臣以外的内阁成员进行过交涉？”指的是你在朝鲜任职的时候。你是这样说的吧？
THE INTERPRETER: MR. Comyns Carr, did you read the answer to that question? If you did, we did not hear it.
口译员：柯明斯-卡尔先生，你是在宣读那个问题的回答吗？如果是的，我们刚才没听到。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): (Continuing) The answer was the words beginning with "outside Korean affairs." " Outside Korean affairs I had no dealings whatsoever with members of the cabinet."
问：（继续）他当时的回答是以“除了朝鲜以外的事务”开始的，“除了朝鲜以外的事务，我没有和内阁成员有交涉。”
A (JIRO MINAMI): That is so.
答：就是那样。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): That answer is correct, is it?
问：那个回答是对的吧？
A (JIRO MINAMI): Correct.
答：没错。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): And in the course of your interrogation, you also said this: "I might explain that in the last fifteen years the thing I have been most against was our war with China as I felt that the peace of Asia could not be maintained unless Japan and China remained at peace." Was that also correct?
问：在接下来的询问记录中，你也说了这样的话：“最近15年间我最为反对的事情就是与中国发生战争。如果中国与日本不能维持和平，那么就无法指望亚洲的和平。”这话是你说的吗？
A (JIRO MINAMI): Yes, correct.
答：是的，没错。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Now, who was your successor as commander in chief of the Kwantung Army?
问：作为关东军司令官，你的继任者是谁？
A (JIRO MINAMI): UEDA, Kenkichi; General.
答：植田谦吉大将。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): UEDA, yes. At the end of July, 1937, did you and UEDA send a written petition to the then Premier KONOYE for the movement of establishing a new administration in North China?
问：植田，哦。1937年7月末左右，植田和你是否曾给当时的首相近卫发了一封请愿书，关于华北开展自治运动建立新的行政机构？
A (JIRO MINAMI): 1937?
答：1937年？
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Yes.
问：是的。
A (JIRO MINAMI): I did not send.
答：我没有发过。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Then if Permier KONOYE said that he had received it what do you say to that?
问：那么如果原首相近卫说收到了你们的请愿书，对此你会怎么说？
A (JIRO MINAMI): As far as I am concerned, I do not recall the matter at all. If shown a document I might, but at the present time I have no recollection of it because I was Governor General of Korea at the time. That is 1937. And in the cabinet, there was no other minister except the Minister of Overseas Affairs who had any dealings with me.
答：我完全记不得那事了。如果真的有这份文件的话，请给我看一下也许能想起来，但是现在完全不记得了，因为当时我还在任朝鲜总督，那是1937年，内阁中除了拓务大臣之外，我没和其他人有过联系。
THE PRESIDENT: In the absence of some good reason, you should show him the document, if you have it.
庭长：如果有这份文件的话，你没有理由不给他看看。
MR. COMYNS CARR: I haven't it, your Honor.
柯明斯-卡尔先生：我没有，庭长先生。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): But I will show you, General MINAMI, another document which I have got and that is prosecution document 1835A. May the original be shown to the witness?
问：但是我可以给你看一下其他的文件，即检方文件第1835犃号。请把文件原件交给证人。
(Whereupon, a paper was handed to the witness.)
（向证人递交文件）
THE PRESIDENT: What is the exhibit number?
庭长：证据编号是多少？
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): (Continuing) Is that your letter?
问：（继续）那是你的信吗？
MR. COMYNS CARR: It isn't at present an exhibit, your Honor. I am seeking to make it one.
柯明斯-卡尔先生：它现在还不是证据，庭长先生。我正要打算提交作为法庭证据。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): (Continuing) General MINAMI, you can tell me whether it is your letter without waiting to read it all.
问：（继续）南大将，你不用全部读完，请你告诉我这是你的书信吗？
THE PRESIDENT: Look at the signature or seal. Is it yours?
庭长：看一下签名或印章。是你的吗？
THE WITNESS: I don't recall it very well.
证人：我不太记得了。
THE PRESIDENT: What do you mean? Do you recognize your signature or seal?
庭长：你什么意思？你不认识你的签名或印章？
MR. COMYNS CARR: He doesn't have the earphones on.
柯明斯-卡尔先生：他没有戴上耳机。
THE PRESIDENT: He used the word "recall" again. He didn't understand it before; the interpreter didn't understand it fully.
庭长：他又用了“recall”这个词。他先前没有很好地理解这个词的含义，口译员也未充分理解。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Is that your signature, or isn't it?
问：是你的签名还是不是？
A (JIRO MINAMI): I would not know unless I see the original.
答：我要看原件才知道。
(Whereupon, a paper was handed to the witness.)
（向证人递交文件）
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Look at that. Isn't that the envelope in which it was sent?
问：请看这份。这是不是你寄信时用的信封？
A (JIRO MINAMI): Yes, though not written by me. It was written by somebody else. I should think it was written by my secretary.
答：是的，但不是我写的，是其他人写的。我想应该是我的秘书写的。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Oh, I see. Now, what we have here--rather, what has been shown to you is certified by the Japanese Foreign Office to be a letter of six pages, dated the 23rd of September, 1938 from you to Foreign Minister UGAKI; isn't it?
问：好的，我知道了。现在我拿到的——给你看的这份文件是由日本外务省证明的一份6页的日文信件，日期是1938年9月23日，由你寄给宇垣外务大臣的。不是吗？
A (JIRO MINAMI): As I recall now, I think that something of that kind might have happened, but I do not recall.
答：据我现在回忆，可能有这件事，但是记不清楚了。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): But isn't the document you have seen the original-your original letter?
问：但你现在所看到的那份文件不是原件——你信的原件吗？
A (JIRO MINAMI): I do not think so.
答：我认为不是。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): Why not?
问：为什么不是？
A (JIRO MINAMI): Because I do--somehow, I do not recall it.
答：因为我确实——我不知怎么想不起来了。
Q (MR. COMYNS CARR): I am not asking you to recall anything. I'm asking you whether the document you have been looking at is your letter with your seal on it.
问：我现在并没有让你去回忆什么事情，我只是问你在看的那份盖有你印章的书信是否是你的文件。
A (JIRO MINAMI): Yes.
答：是的。
MR. COMYNS CARR: Then I ask that it be received in evidence, your Honor.
柯明斯-卡尔先生：那么我请求将其提交作为法庭证据，庭长先生。
THE PRESIDENT: It took a long time to get that simple acknowledgment. It is admitted on the usual terms.
庭长：为了得到这个简单确认，花了不少的时间。根据通常规定，予以接受。
CLERK OF THE COURT: Prosecution's document No. 1835-A will receive exhibit No. 2437.
法庭书记员：接受检方文件第1835-A号，编为第2437号证据。
(Whereupon, the document above referred to was marked prosecution’s exhibit No. 2437 and received in evidence.)
（法庭接受检方提交的第2437号证据）
MR. BROOKS: May the defense be furnished copies of this document, your Honor?
布鲁克斯先生：我请求向辩方递交该文件的副本，庭长先生。
THE PRESIDENT: We so direct.
庭长：请按辩方要求执行。
MR. COMYNS CARR: And may the witness retain either the original or a Japanese copy so that he can follow?
柯明斯-卡尔先生：是否可以让证人保留原件或日文副本一份？这样他就可以跟上了。
THE PRESIDENT: Give him the original. He has a copy.
庭长：请给证人原件。现在他手上的是副本。
(Whereupon, a paper was handed to the witness.)
（向证人递交文件）
MR. COMYNS CARR: (Reading)
柯明斯-卡尔先生：（宣读）
23 September 1938
1938年9月23日
From: General MINAMI, Jiro, Governor-General of Korea
朝鲜总督南次郎大将
To: His Excellency, the Foreign Minister UGAKI, Issei
致外务大臣宇垣一成阁下
Sir:
阁下：
Approximately one year has passed since the outbreak of the Sino-Japanese Incident. Through the good policy of Your Excellency as Prime Minister"- that is a mistake. It should be Foreign Minister--"at a time when the situation is so extremely grave, the prestige of our country is being enhanced at home and abroad, and I feel it is a matter for congratulations for the sake of our nation.
日华事变（指卢沟桥事变，译者注）爆发至今已逾一年，值此重大时局之际，因得您首相阁下——此处错误，应为外务大臣。筹划之良策，我国国威得以向海内外宣扬，此乃吾邦可喜可贺之事。
Ever since the Incident our troops have been invincible, and I believe Hankow, the last capitol of the Chiang Regime, will soon be conquered.
事变爆发以来，皇军所向披靡，我想蒋政权最后的首都汉口不久也将被攻陷。
It is natural that the significance of the fall of Hankow, in this Holy War, will have an extremely great influence at home and abroad. I feel there are many measures to be taken by our nation at this juncture, but the most important problem, I believe, is the recognition of a pro-Japanese Regime in North and Central China simultaneously with the fall of Hankow, and to expound it at home and abroad.
毫无疑问，此回圣战中汉口陷落对国内外的影响颇为重大，此关键时刻我国可采取之施策固然很多，但我认为最紧要的乃是陷落的同时向国内外宣布承认华北的亲日政权。
The recognition of a pro-Japanese Regime by our country will, internally, convince our people of the progress of our policy in China; and externally, give the Chinese masses a strong suggestion that there is no other way than to get rid of the Chiang Regime and depend on the new Regime, and at the same time the third powers behind Chiang will also fully realize that there is no other way than to approach the pro-Japanese regime in order to protect their own rights and interests. I believe it will have great effect at home and abroad.
我国承认亲日新政权，对内可以使我国国民弄清我们对华方针的动向；对外可以给予中国民众强烈暗示，脱离蒋政权的束缚投靠新政权，同时蒋政权背后的第三国势力也会充分明白只有靠向亲日新政权才能维护本国的权益。我相信这无论是在国内还是在国外都会产生绝好效应。
I feel Your Excellency has already given individual consideration to various measures to be taken after the fall of Hankow, but it is my wish to have Your Excellency make final judgment on this point.
在汉口攻陷后，阁下已经下达各种英明裁断，但关于这一点还想请阁下对愚见做出决断。
Yours respectfully
敬上。
